Knicks Fanatics

The Ultimate In Knicks Fandom and Fellowship

D’Antoni: “If We Lose, We Lose. . . .”


D'Antoni On Losing in 2009


Check out the following video of Training Camp Scrimmages courtesy of Posting and Toasting.



October 1, 2009 - Posted by | Mike D'Antoni, New York Knicks | ,


  1. “Commit to playing much better defense,do a better job in practice (particularly with boxing out and getting to loose balls),make better decisions on the bench a habit,put in a few plays besides giving the ball to a mismatch as an endgame, trade for a shotblocker (he doesn’t have to be a star!), and play hard both ways.Many of these guys come from programs where they break the huddle with, “Hard Work!”.Let’s see some.I’m OK with that and I think LeBron would be too!
    Free Plax/LGK

    Comment by Tman | October 1, 2009 | Reply

  2. TMAN! Or, Should I say Coach TMAN! You are absolutely RIGHT… WORK THESE MOFO’S until they Vomit, Pass out, or until thye face is cramping up and get them in the best shape they can be…D is ALL ABOUT DESIRE, TRUST, AND ESPEIALLY TEAM (Together Everyone Achieves More) Stress and work on the Defensive Scheme…We know the O works, but you’ve get stops in critical siutations…PLAIN & SIMPLE

    Go to the VIDEO TPAE like your NAME IS WARNER WOLFE, and show these MOFO”S how they let a PLAYOFF BIRTH SLIP AWAY because of their POUROUS DEFENSE… You don’t play D, catch a few SPLINTERS in the AZZ… Gotta be real about this THANG…

    TMAN COACH OF THE YEAR!!!! Pop on down my Good Brother and pick up the HARDWARE Steady, Bronx, Harlem, STATE’S, and MODI have for ya…LOL LOL LOL


    Keep it CRACKIN!

    Comment by Cooleyhigh | October 1, 2009 | Reply

  3. D’Antoni’s statement: “If we lose, we lose…” sounds like:
    (1) he expects to lose big-time with this bunch and can say I warned you, so I should keep my job until I get better players (2) he is advising fans not to expect too much, but just enough, so he can say he did better than anyone expected; and/or (3) he really hopes to win enough games to actually make the playoffs and become coach of the year. Once again, I will root for the later but expect the former 1st or 2nd implication.

    As Beck notes the likely starting lineup of: Lee, Harrington, Gallo, Chandler and Duhon is a small sized group but has enough experience and savy to compete against several teams, who do not have a dominant size differential. N8, Darko and Jeffries will be the first o off the bench and Douglas may also crack the rotation. A healthy Gallo and Darko as a replacement for Q-brick makes the team different from last season, but remains to be seen if overall improvement can follow.

    Hill, Hughes, and Curry (unless he gets healthy and in game shape) will likely ride the bench for most of the season. I believe that Cutino Mobley is to be carried as the 14th player (under an expiring contract); and the 15th spot is open for competition between various players invited to training camp: Sun Yue, Warren Carter, Ron Howard, Chris Hunter, Marcus Landry and Gabe Pruitt. I would venture that Greg Pruitt has the best shot of making the team as a 3rd point guard in case Duhon or Douglas get hurt, but I want to see him play in the preseason before I would commit a bet on it.

    Knicks play againt the Nets in the first preseason game on Sunday, October 4th (in Albany, N.Y.) Televised on MSG starting at 2:00 p.m. LGK

    Comment by Post-up Prince | October 1, 2009 | Reply

  4. “D’Antoni said he envisions Douglas and Robinson playing together in a lightning-quick alignment.

    “They’re an intriguing tandem,” D’Antoni said. “Together they can create havoc on the other team. They’re so fast and dynamic.”

    Now that’s an interesting idea, Of course you need a defensive scheme to fit it into.Duhon is a decent defender also, but you need at least one more guard, or you’ll burn out your trio.But hey, wait a minute!Don’t you have a 6’5″athletic guard with long arms and good defensive instincts on your bench?Larry, Larry, Larry….HUGHES!Point is, if you REALLY want to apply some pressure and create turnovers in transition you got the folks to do it.Your ball Mike?Free Plax/LGK

    Comment by Tman | October 2, 2009 | Reply

    • Duhon … lightning quick?

      Comment by orangeandblue1 | October 2, 2009 | Reply

    • Actually David Kahn’s boys Johnny Flynn and Ramon Sessions might better fit that description. Maybe “[ ]”‘Antoni is smoking something! Pass the …

      Comment by orangeandblue1 | October 2, 2009 | Reply

  5. Fanatics,

    Talkin the Talk, & Talkin the Talk.

    Never judge a man (or coach), by his words. His actions will articulate the truth. When D’Antoni states that he will put an emphasis on Defense this year, and then has a projected first team of Harrington, Roost-Ta, Dlee, Duhon & Chandler, I realized that D’Antoni is full of West Virginia Shyte.

    Neither of the 3 can or will get a stop. Roost-TA at the 3 lacks the foot-speed to stop anyone. Dlee in the middle lacks the size or quickness to defend or block shots. Harrington on defense is thinking of his next shot on the offensive end. I cannot think of a more defensive challenged front court. In fact due to being finesse players Roost-TA and Dlee will be turnstiles as players go to the hoop with very little resistance. The objective appears to score as many points as possible in the first quarter, while hoping the other team’s first unit has yet to warm up. Look for the Knicks to be at the bottom of the league in field goal defense. If D’Antoni was serious about defense then JJ, Darko, Hill or any of the other offensively challenged stiffs would start.
    BTW-Rebounding is considered playing defense and I see this team giving up a lot of second shots. So D’Antoni is Talkin the Talk & Talkin the Talk. Nothing more or nothing less.

    Duhon cannot stop the point guards from penetrating and there is not anyone in the front-court to stop keep the little guys out of the lane. See point guards games against the knicks last year. Chandler was a 4 in college groomed to be a 3, in the pros, but now playing the 2. What a waste of talent!! He lacks the lateral quickness to stop the 2s in the league, but should be able to have an offensive advantage, (D‘Antoni‘s thinking offense). If D’Antoni was serious then Huges would be in the mix. He’s the team’s best defender. D’Antoni is Talkin the Talk.

    Quick Hits

    1) Curry believers. Are you surprised or disappointed?
    2) Can the Knicks afford a project at # 8 in the draft?
    3) If the Knicks goal was to punt last season and this
    one, then Why not bring in a rookie coach and just play
    young guys.
    4) Has Donnie improved the talent in the last 2-years?
    5) Is D’Antoni’s talk of Defense the equivalent of Knicks’
    fans talk of “Happy Week”
    6) Is Auggie a Reincarnated blogger posting under a
    different name?
    7) Will this year suck the life out of Knick fans, or will
    “Wait til 2010” become the slogan in December?

    Peace & Blessings

    Comment by Statesman2 | October 2, 2009 | Reply

    • Tman

      Very well said, nice that you read between lines, and see whose on the court for the starting 5 and whose on the sidelines.

      I think the starting line up is consistent with “[ ]”‘Antoni’s primary coaching emphasis and style. Load the court with a bunch of gunners and finishers on the offensive end. He’ll gamble true to form that his starting 5 should be able to outscore plenty,… though not many nor nearly enough teams to make the playoffs, during the season.

      That’s why he’s hedged his bet, fully knowing what he’s putting on the court doesn’t match with his intent to be around the upper half of teams in the defensive category.

      Comment by orangeandblue1 | October 2, 2009 | Reply

      • Whoops I meant to say good point Statesman 1-3 the threkill.

        Comment by orangeandblue1 | October 2, 2009

    • Check the end of season stats regarding rebounding.

      Although the Knicks ranked in the lower top ten in total rebounding, they were 26th in rebounding differential giving up 4 more rebounds per game than they secured. Only only the Warriors, Kings, and the Clippers had hire differentials in that category.

      My rant will be out today.

      Comment by orangeandblue1 | October 2, 2009 | Reply

      • Darko and Hill (if he get’s any playing time) should help the rebounding somewhat over what was there in the past: Jerome James and Q Rich. They could also potentially improve the team’s shot blocking stats. Gallo’s ability to rebound at the 3 spot is suspect; the Rooster may need to switch with Chandler on offense and defense–i.e. Gallo playing the 2 on D and 3 on O and Chandler the 3 on D and 2 on O.

        Comment by Post-up Prince | October 2, 2009

      • I concur with your point on the match-up switches that Nilo and Chandler will have to exchange in on defense during the regular season.

        OBTW I’m going to Live Blogg the preseason start Knicks v. Nets.

        Whose up for the LBE?

        Comment by orangeandblue1 | October 2, 2009

    • no way man!

      Comment by auggie | October 2, 2009 | Reply

      • You mean that in disbelief or that it’s not a good idea?

        Comment by orangeandblue1 | October 2, 2009

      • i mean no way im a reincarnated blogger with a different name like statesman says

        Comment by auggie | October 3, 2009

  6. Statesman 1-3, hit the nose on the head regarding the relationship between the projected starting line-up and the truth about defensive emphasis.

    I have no doubt that the Knicks will put on an excellent offensive show as long as Duhon or whoever the guard is can pop those mid-range jumpers. However, the Knicks, with the projected first unit, will leak like a colander. You absolutely do not need to have Five shooters on the floor at the same time.

    Comment by livesinnewjersey | October 2, 2009 | Reply

    • Lives,

      I gave “[ ]”Antoni credit last year for working Chandler and Jefferies into regular spots in the rotation. I did so primarily b/c they are two of the teams better defenders.

      However, yes… with that offense first lineup, I think “[ ]”Antoni may be making the same bone headed moves Isiah did before he got canned.

      Comment by orangeandblue1 | October 2, 2009 | Reply

  7. Nice to be talking the game, instead of the blame, for a change.It’s still a 48 minute game and who starts is only important for egos, admittedly more important for the weakest ones, on a loser.Very true the so-called starting line-up is offensive in both a scoring and stink-it-up defensive set-up, but that’s why you play different combos at different times, remember the idea is to win.You play many different teams with different strengths and weaknesses.Unless you can overpower teams with what you do, and we apparantlly can’t, the answer is flexibility and team commitment, the good kind hopefully.Ideally you would want a good defensive five as starters, that ain’t gonna happen this yeah, at least not right away.Yeah, I’m a dreamer, hey, skip some rope David Lee, make those feet quicker!But if you can “unleash the dogs of war” in key moments, and keep some flexibility as part of your defensive scheme, your defensive turnovers will create easy baskets.This is B-ball folks, closer to checkers than chess.That said,and again it’s a pleasure to talk ball instead of bull.And I’m as guilty as anyone, two quick observations.An in shape, motivated Larry Hughes is probably better than Duhon, who I happen to like a lot.Duhon was hurt and asked to do to much.Given rational minutes and sharing the point with Hughes, a two position guy, please, work a little harder on your shot selection Larry,I think will make him, Duhon, very effective, barring injury.Secondly, the Knick middle has been an open door for years and good defense up top isn’t an answer for closing the highway to the rim.D.Walsh should be diligently searching the D-league and please come up with a shot blocking rebounder for at least this year.Darko plugs the middle, but instills no fear for the quick and the elevated.We don’t need a scorer there, just someone to set up shop and reject the pretenders who are living it up on our dime.Can’t get to the playoffs without the missing link.There’s got to be some defensive monster roaming the tundra.Find him Donnie.In closing, hope springs eternal.Next week we may be up D’Antoni’s azz for no defensive effort, no rebounding (Guys remember to box out!),no team esprit, but this week anything is still possible!At last, the real season is beginning.Football is only good on the weekends!Oh yeah,Free Plaxico/LGK!

    Comment by Tman | October 2, 2009 | Reply

  8. Chris Seina’s season outlook, 9/30/09

    2008-09 Record: 32-50, 14th in the Eastern Conference
    2008-09 FIC Ranking: 20th, -10.4 per game
    Key Additions: Darko Milicic
    Key Subtractions: Quentin Richardson, Chris Wilcox
    Key Rookies: Jordan Hill, Toney Douglas
    Probable Starters: Chris Duhon, Larry Hughes, Wilson Chandler, Al Harrington, David Lee

    Point Guard: Chris Duhon had a nice first half in Mike D’Antoni’s SSoL system, but his body broke down with the heavy minutes and he remains a point guard best suited as an above average back-up. To his credit, Duhon was everything the Knicks asked and paid him to be, playing nearly 1,000 more minutes than his previous high while logging career highs in all shooting categories and assists per 36 minutes. The Knicks would be wise to pace Duhon a little bit better, who is once again the only pure point guard on the roster after the club ultimately shied away from signing restricted free agent Ramon Sessions.

    Nate Robinson will come off the bench again with his instant offense and energy. He hasn’t developed as a point guard and his future is as an Eddie House type of scorer, who will be a high volume, 20 points per 36 minutes scorer. He is a competent perimeter shooter, who could once again flirt with 40% shooting from distance if he had better scorers around him. He also rebounds extremely well for his size and has become less mistake prone overall. Robinson creates headaches both for opponents and his own team sometimes, but the Knicks are unquestionably better when he is on the floor and the neglect he was shown on the open market was somewhat surprising (with the caveat that I would tend to avoid him as well if I were a GM).

    Like Robinson, newcomer Toney Douglas isn’t really a point guard. He was a fifth-year senior out of Florida State and is a gadget type of player (again like Robinson), though he could of course click well in D’Antoni’s system.

    Swingmen: Danilo Gallinari represents the Knicks’ best chance/only chance of developing an All-Star from their current roster. He is a supremely gifted offensive player, with once in a generation skills as a shooter and passer. His health appears to be something that will perpetually be an issue, but he has looked much stronger and more athletic according to almost all reports.

    Wilson Chandler has a lot of tools, but doesn’t do one thing exceptionally well and doesn’t project very well as a scorer. He ideally will improve his spot-up shooting (32.8% from distance) with the hope he morphs into a Trevor Ariza kind of utility player once the Knicks find their superstar.

    Larry Hughes’ minutes will likely decline as the season progresses, as his role is to bring some semblance of experience to the wing position. Both the seasons before and after Hughes’ brilliant 04-05 have been extremely pedestrian, but he has developed a more reliable shot from distance, which of course works well in New York’s offensive system. His effectiveness as a defensive player has declined dramatically, however, which was once the most valuable aspect of his game.

    The most valuable swingman on the Knicks’ roster other than Gallinari is perhaps Cuttino Mobley, whose contract is 80% guaranteed and could net the Knicks cap relief or a young asset.

    Frontcourt: With David Lee and Al Harrington, New York has two very good scorers that are well below average defensively.

    The Knicks are lucky to have Lee back because this would be a downright nightmare of a situation if he would have left with nothing in return this summer. He has his limitations, but he is an extremely efficient scorer and rebounder, at least on this club.

    Harrington couldn’t be in a situation more ideal, as he has a perpetual green light to shoot from anywhere on the floor, the defensive obligations are mildly grueling to say the least and Lee will rebound for the two of them. Like the player he was traded for, Jamal Crawford, Harrington will enjoy one final 20 point per night season before heading back to reality in 10-11.

    Jordan Hill has been knocked around a little bit following his underwhelming summer league showing, but he isn’t an All-Star or nothing type of big. He is athletic and is far from a finished product, yet has consistently shown substantial strides in his improvement while at Arizona. He has enough growth potential in his body to become a D’Antoni style center, though his first order of business will probably be to prove he has a brighter future than Cleveland’s young power forward, J.J. Hickson.

    Darko Milicic won’t all of a sudden blossom into the guy Joe Dumars and Chad Ford expected him to be in 2003 when inserted into D’Antoni’s system, but this is certainly the best chance he has to succeed. The Knicks need him to shoot better than 50% from the floor while blocking two or three shots per 36 minutes. He instantly becomes their best shotblocking threat they have had in years and years and years.

    With Jerome James gone, Jared Jeffries’ lone remaining claim to fame is being the final overpriced free agent acquisition leftover from the Isiah Thomas era, not counting the Eddy Curry sign-and-trade.

    Speaking of Curry, he has lost a lot of weight and has a chance at contributing actual minutes this season. He has become the punchline to a lot of jokes and has been a disappointment considering the price tag and the way Isiah Thomas pinned the franchise’s hopes on his shoulders, but the first two seasons in New York were far from horrible and he doesn’t turn 27 until December. Curry isn’t the right kind of center for D’Antoni and he has always been a woeful shotblocker and rebounder, but he isn’t the kind of player that can be completely written off in the manner the Knicks did with James about two months after they signed him in 2005.

    Forecast: The Knicks will continue to be one of the highest scoring teams in the NBA, but that is why offensive rating is such an invaluable marker. New York was ranked 17th, with 108.1 points per 100 possessions and that number is unlikely to improve by much.

    D’Antoni will try to stress an improved commitment defensively, but are a long ways away from being a top-15 team (they were ranked 23rd last season).

    With a few breaks here and there in those close games last season, the Knicks could have won an additional two or three games, but the playoffs are a near impossible advancement, especially since the Raptors and Wizards missed the playoffs last season and have improved significantly.

    The Knicks were a net +9.4 points per 100 possessions better with Gallinari on the floor, so a healthy season from him would be the only real difference in terms of personnel that can improve this team in the short-term.

    Their most effective lineup will clearly be Robinson, Chandler, Gallinari, Lee and Harrington, which is likely how D’Antoni will choose to close games.

    Ultimately, this season is almost exclusively about two things though:

    1. Eliminate the contracts of Jeffries and Curry.

    2. Develop the young players into the kind of core a top-echelon free agent feels he can win with.

    Comment by Paul | October 2, 2009 | Reply

    • The thing for every Knick fan to hope for Chandler to continue to develop and bring the much needed aggressiveness to his game, that our draft picks develop over the course of the next few seasons, that Nilo is as advertised in terms of his terms of his offensive potential and that that his disk surgery doesn’t narrow the window on his NBA career.

      Let’s see what happens of course.

      Comment by orangeandblue1 | October 2, 2009 | Reply

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in: Logo

You are commenting using your account. Log Out / Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out / Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out / Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out / Change )

Connecting to %s

%d bloggers like this: